A Conversation About Art with Hadley Powell of Powell Fine Art Advisory

And today I have a very special guest with me. Her name is Hadley Powell, and, uh, she's an art consultant. Welcome to radio Maine Hadley. Thank you so much for having me. It's a real treat. I'm especially interested to hear about your connection to Maine because it runs pretty deep, doesn't it? Yes, absolutely. Um, born and raised in Western Maine. My parents moved there in the seventies and, um, I had an amazing, I, I feel like I'm a true Mainer in every sense of the word. Um, and I actually met my husband in Maine. One summer. His family had actually spent Spence has spent their summers in Maine for his whole life. So it's a special place for both me, cause I grew up there, but also for our family Now, you're you said you, your parents went to, uh, came to Maine in the seventies where they have the back to the Lander group or what was the connection? I think they were friends with a lot of the back to the Lander group, but, um, they actually met in Boston and my dad is a minister and had been at Harvard divinity school. And there was a posting for an internship in Farmington, Maine at a small church there. So he did it, he went up one summer and, and did the internship. And my mom, they were dating at the time and came to visit him and they completely fell in love with the town and the people. And he was offered a job and it was going to be sort of like a five-year stint for him, which turned into 35 years. Um, and he raised, they, my parents raised me and my sister in Farmington. And then I went to Gould Academy, which is a small boarding school in Bethel Maine, and, and have just sort of loved Maine ever since And not, not to get too far off the track of Hadley versus Hadley's family. But, um, tell me about the very special ministry that your father did. That was actually quite unique. It wasn't the same type of ministry that everybody everywhere did. Well. He was a Presbyterian minister for the bulk of his career, but then the last 10 years, he was the director of the Maine Seacoast mission, which is actually based in bar Harbor. And they've now moved to Northeast Harbor, um, Maine on Mount desert Island. And what's exciting about the Maine Seacoast mission is that they have this incredible boat called the Sunbeam, which is a steel hold ice breaker. Um, and it goes out to all the islet, small islands off the coast of Maine. They've actually he's, my father has since retired, but, um, with COVID they've been vaccinating, um, Islanders. And so they've been going out and taking, you know, doing both, um, sort of ministry as well as social services, as well as just straight, um, community building. It's a, it's a really great organization. I happened to have been on the Sunbeam actually more than once and one time overnight because I was interested in the work they were doing, um, medically. And so I had a chance to connect with a doctor on the mainland that they were a video conferencing in, and it was really interesting to see the use of technology. Um, this was quite a few years ago and this was before we were all doing. Um, yeah. So, um, Medicine initiatives have been amazing and exactly, especially now that everyone is sort of going going much more video conferencing, the video conferencing direction, it's like a much more natural experience, I think now, Well, speaking of, um, the video experience, how has this impacted the work that you do as an art consultant? Sure. It's been a really interesting, Um, you know, I think when COVID first hit and we were all in lockdown last spring and into the summer, everyone was sort of frozen in many ways, trying to sort of understand how they were going to navigate this new world. For me, it's been, um, you know, we've all had to adapt. I've been utilizing zoom with clients, which actually has been pretty, um, similar to how I would almost interact in the past because often when I'm starting to work with a client, I'll put together a proposal, you know, usually see images of the home or go tour the home. And so that was obviously a little different, but, um, I'll put together a proposal of ideas and then I would take them through the proposal over zoom. So it was not the same as being there in person, but we could kind of move pretty quickly. And then once decisions were starting to be made and we had a sense for what artworks the client really wanted to see. Um, we would be working, I would work to either have artwork shipped or I would physically bring the artwork into the home. Um, and actually that's really sort of when I started working really closely with the Portland art gallery, because Emma was so amazing and would bring me carloads of artwork to client's homes so we could see things in person. Um, you know, and so obviously making sure we were all being really safe, but there were, were definitely adjustments we've been making. Um, and then also just boosting my digital presence. So when COVID hit, I started a podcast, I'd always been doing a newsletter, but I went from sort of quarterly to monthly. Um, and then also utilizing Instagram more and more to really reach out to my clients. You've also done this all through, um, raise and raising your family at the same time. Yes. And that was obviously has been a struggle, um, especially with a two year old who historically would love to go to museums and galleries herself and we would take her all the time. And since COVID, we haven't gone as much, we've started to go a little bit more now that things are opening up a little bit more, but it was hard not being able to have, you know, have family museum dates, which is what we had been doing a lot when she was first. And then you added another member of the family in the middle of all of this as well, Three weeks ago. So baby Astor was born three weeks ago. Um, she's happily sleeping in the room next to me. And so I hope that she stays that way for the next half an hour or so. So this was interesting to me because, um, you have clearly integrated your work and your family life pretty much from the beginning. It's um, and it seems like it's been important to you to do that. It is, that's your, it's a really thoughtful question and something that I care a lot about, I would say my husband is also, I mean, he's a lawyer, so he has a completely different profession, but he's also really passionate about the arts. And that was something that sort of brought us together from day one. And he loves to go to museums and galleries with me and he's done some photography himself. He's sort of like the man behind my Instagram account. Uh, but it is, it's something that I care a lot about because for me it's so much more than just a job, it's really a passion. And so it's something I'm thinking about all day every day. Um, and when you have your own business, you kind of have to be doing that. You have to really care. And so weekends are often spent thinking about artwork, sometimes seeing clients, um, evenings the same, um, w there's I have great flexibility, which I, which is something that I was really, it was a goal for me, was to be able to have at this point, this stage in my life have that flexibility so that I could be with my kids when I, I wanted to, but also have, um, have the, the B being, working in a role that, that made the facilitated that, um, but it is, it's something that, that I care a lot about. And, you know, when we could travel, our travel always was, was associated with art, be it to an art fair or to a city in Europe that had a great museum, you know, art has becomes completely integrated into my life. Tell me about your, um, growing up and growing into your love of art, because it sounds like you've really done a lot with your own children in this area, but I'm guessing that you had, um, some of this sort of incorporated into your childhood as well. Definitely. Um, and that's actually a trend I've seen with a lot of people in the arts. Um, when I worked at Christie's in New York and would talk to my colleagues and we'd all kind of say, you know, when did you first fall in love with artwork? And basically everyone said, because my parents took me to museums as a kid. And that's something that's really important because you have to be constantly training your eye. And so you need to have years and years and years of doing that. And I remember going to like the national gallery in Washington with my parents when I was like six. Um, and so that I think was a big part of my love of art is because my parents were always interested in art and looking at art and talking about art, um, not in a way that they're, they would never call themselves collectors, but they are very sort of aesthetically attuned. Um, my dad loves photography. He wrote part of his senior thesis on Walker Evans. So that's always been a thread. And then my mom has a greatest aesthetic, um, and loves design. And so those, both of those things definitely sort of filtered into me and they've always been completely supportive of my interest in the arts. So when I was in college and I decided I switched from an IEC becoming an econ major to an art history major, they were both super supportive and happy that I did that. Um, and whenever I would want to go to museums or whenever we would travel and I was interested in sort of checking out the art scene, they were onboard. You also, um, hadn't experienced that Gould that, um, kind of solidified your love of art. Well, gold just has an amazing visual arts program. They had what, at the time it was like the art cottage and some of my favorite teachers at gold were all arts, art teachers. Um, my soccer coach is like a metal worker. Um, and so it was really neat to be surrounded by that at such a young age. Um, and so I took photography at Gould and I took everyone takes sort of like an intro to design. Um, and so being around a community that really supported and was interested in the arts has always been something that I've sort of looked at and enjoyed. So you talked a little bit earlier about, uh, training the eye and having this be a, basically a lifelong process, whether we realize it or not. Do you think that one of the things that you have to offer as an art consultant is to help people, um, I guess, train their own eyes or look at things with a fresh set of eyes so that they can see how art might fit into their own spaces? Absolutely. Um, I think that one thing that I do as an art consultant or that my clients hire me for is that expertise. And so there's so much out there and it can be completely overwhelming, especially if you're new to looking at art. And so what I do is I essentially sort of narrow down the field for them so that I can show them some of that, like, you know, 10 items versus a hundred or 10 versus 30, and really sort of begin to focus for them and start to share sort of, these are the things you should be looking for. Uh, one thing that I always tell clients is that think about what was the artist trying? What was the goal for the artwork? What was the artist trying to accomplish? What's the idea, and then did they do that successfully? And so if you sort of approach artwork in that way, you have a set of questions to ask, as you're reviewing the artwork, it can be really helpful, um, to sort of fine tune, you know, what is what's, what's successful, what's working and what's not. And then also it's obviously it's personal taste. And so sometimes people need to have someone to just sort of validate that their taste is, is great and that they are always drawn to something, be it a color or a form or a subject. And that's okay. You know, allowing people to sort of feel like, even though they may be, didn't study it in college, or haven't spent a ton of time looking at it, if they continued to gravitate toward the same thing, that means something. And we let's look at that and let's talk about that. Um, so that's a lot of the training that I do with clients. It's a lot of education. Um, and when clients are just starting out, I, we spend a lot of time, you know, I send them books before COVID, we'd go to art fairs together. We'd go to galleries together. Um, I'd just be sharing them images constantly just to get a sense for what is, what is, what are you interested in what's, what's sort of sparking some curiosity and or what, what are you not interested at all in? Is it hard for people to get to that place where they feel safe, trusting their own instinct when it comes to art? I think it completely Depends. It completely depends on, you know, your background and if you grew up with artwork or, you know, but, but generally I would say yes, I think it helps to sort of have someone validate in many ways what you're thinking or the direction you're going. Um, I've recently worked with clients who were very new to looking at artwork, but really needed to have, they were, they had sort of a gut reaction. Um, and I was there to kind of say, no, let's, let's follow that. Let's pursue that. Let's actually like lean into that a little bit. Um, and the fact that you're interested in abstraction for example, is great and let's look at lots of different ways that artists use obstruction in their practices. Um, and so that was something that was really helpful for this client to then finally to say, you know, actually I feel comfortable with what I'm responding to. Um, and, and so I sort of help guide them through that process. What do you, You do with people who come in, um, with a family member who maybe they like abstract art and the family member likes, I don't know, cubism, let's just say like, how do you bring those pieces together? A little bit of like marital counseling that I do in many cases, because a lot of times my clients are couples or partners. Um, and so it's really interesting. And usually we'll get to the point where both, both parties agree. And so we'll say no to things that one partner loved and we'll say no to something that the other partner loved. And then often sometimes partners or, you know, someone in the relationship or whoever's living in the house almost gets their own space. So like an office or a personal area or a nook. And they get to say yes to anything that goes there. And then, but for other spaces in the home living room or family room, there's true veto power where, you know, one, one, one spouse can say no to that. Um, but I think that's really important because if someone has like a creative impulse or is really passionate about something and the other one isn't that's life, you know, people are individuals and people are different and you're allowed to sort of indulge that as, as, as, as an individual and as a human, um, but for, for common spaces or for spaces where everyone's going to be there all the time, we definitely try to look for something that both, um, both people agree on. I'm sure interior designers run into this all the time, too, um, where, you know, making decisions on the home. And there are a couple people involved in the decision making. I have, I've had conversations with people who aren't involved with, um, selling homes. So people will, they'll say to me, it does end up being almost marital counseling sometimes because it's such a big life change and you're really committing to something and art isn't quite to that level, but it kind of is because you're committing to the space that you're going to live in. And most people don't flip around their art, you know, on a monthly basis, it's really something they're choosing to make part of their lives. Absolutely. Um, it's, it's something that's significant. And I think that some clients don't realize that buying artwork is, is really emotional in many ways. And the artists themselves have put so much into the piece and it's like a living breathing thing in many ways. Like one of my early clients, we bought a piece, it took her a while. We, we, we worked through a number of different styles and pieces and price points and everything. We landed on this great painting, kind of an abstract landscape over the couch. And afterwards she said that was a lot harder, like more emotionally taxing than I was expecting it to be. Then just like, she was like, you know, when we bought the furniture for the house, it was easy. It was like, okay, that's a sofa, that's a chair. And that's a rug, but this was a lot harder. And it it's because I said to her, it's a unique object. You know, it's something that someone has really put a lot of thought behind. Um, and so artwork lives in my belief, you know, I think it has, it can evoke a mood, obviously it can evoke so many emotions. And then I think once it's up on the wall, people really start responding to that, which is why I think it's so important to see things in person before you'd make a decision. And why so often I'm bringing, you know, carloads of artwork to client's homes. So we can start to put things up and see what, you know, what's the scale like, what's the, what are the colors like? How does it make you feel? And, um, thankfully so many galleries are so, um, generous in letting you know, loaning works for a couple of days, so people can kind of sleep on it, see it during different lights, see it in the morning, see it in the evening and kind of get a sense for what this thing is going to be like in their home. Behind me in the studio, I have a Steve Rogers piece, and I know he was one of the artists that you have worked with at the art gallery. And there are several others. Um, what are some of the things about, let's say Steve Rogers work that you were kind of looking at when you were considering this piece for the client you were working with. I mean, in that example, it's the amazing perspective. And I would say the piece behind you also has that incredible perspective that it just draws you into the space. Like you're instantly outside. It looks like from what I can see, it's like a snowy field with like maybe crops that had been there fallen over, um, and that's what the clients were drawn to as well. Um, and it's, what's amazing about the example, the one, um, the one that I worked on, it was an Aspen sort path. And so they're this gorgeous aspens and, um, peak fall, beautiful yellows and oranges, but what, and it's whole large piece. It was large-scale. Um, and we put it in a pretty narrow, tight little dining room. And so what's so great about how he composes his, um, his works is that you see you're instantly in them. And so we, we didn't need you to step back to kind of take in the whole, the whole picture plane. You're just, you're instantly in it. Um, what's also so great about the example that we're talking about. It was this, you know, again, these gorgeous autumnal, yellows and oranges, and the client had this beautiful blue wall covering. And so there's just like, it jumps off this wall and it really feels like it's like a window into nature. And they were instantly like, yes. I mean, it was like an immediate response and it, like, it feels like it was painted for this room. Um, the, the house in general is like a really cozy, beautiful kind of traditional new England home. And so that was a really fun painting to work on one because the client like instantly felt said yes, and it just felt like such a win. And how, um, how just transportive the work generally is As someone who grew up in Maine, um, you're opposite familiar with the landscape and the changing nature of the seasons and the beauty that's sort of all around us. Do you think that people who are drawn to Maine may also be drawn to art because they have, um, a connection with this sort of exterior beauty that they want to bring into their homes? It's a, that's a really great point. I think I've never actually thought of it that way, but there are so many creatives in Maine and there's so many people who maybe they don't describe themselves as artists, but they knit, or they are, you take photographs or they do a little like quilting on the side. You know, there's just so many people who I think are naturally interested in the arts who live in Maine. Um, it is, it's so inspiring. I would say, like when we go for walks or, you know, and I'm always looking at like the textures and the colors or, um, where we are on Mount desert Island, it's like the granite is this really distinct pink. That is just so specific to that place. And I think that if you spend time observing nature, you do become just more aware of your surroundings or color and nuances of, um, of the landscape. I have a client who's a beautiful landscape painter herself and goes to vinyl Haven. And, um, really the goal of her artwork is to sort of share with people who don't go there, how beautiful it is. And, and she does that really successfully. I mean, there are these like really happy, wonderful landscape paintings that when, you know, the craggy nature of the rocks or, you know, how, you know, pine trees get all gnarled because of they're too close to the ocean or the, you know, or the liken that the specific color of the lichen as it develops on the tree branches or on the rocks. Um, I think all of that, you really can see an artwork. I there's an artist, Nancy Simons, who I know she's based in Boston, but is represented by Portland art gallery. And her work is really influenced by Maine. And specifically she has a series of like avoids that really, to me always feel like Riverstone's, or like the rocks on the West coast of Maine. And I think I gravitate to her work so much because I'm so used to seeing like the natural element and how she brings both of those together As part of people's, um, I guess, healing and self care during the pandemic. We've had a lot of people who have visited Mount desert, so I'm sure you've noticed them in your own backyard. Um, but also really the state of Maine. And I think they found some space and some solace and some healing gear in a pretty significant way. Um, is that your sense that part of what people are kind of reaching toward is that, that ability to heal during these really difficult times? It's, um, I've heard so many artists, especially artists who depict work that is really sort of like Nat, like natural or more sort of meditative. Um, and they've seen a real uptick in their sales, B and T. And in talking to people who are buying their work, they have said it's because they want to look at something that makes them happy, you know, and I think there is that healing nature. And like, there are definitely certain colors that can be really soothing or relaxing. And when people are spending so much time at home, if they had blank walls, they're like, well, what do I want to put on that wall? I want to put something that makes me feel good. And so it there's, there is definitely a theme there. Um, and there obviously have been so many studies done about how the importance of being in nature, um, and how it can, you know, really be a mood booster. I think about, you know, forest bathing, where people kind of go immerse themselves. There's just something that Mainers, like, that's what we do every day. You know, it's such a funny concept, but if you live in a more urban area, you know, I live in Brookline and actually we have a lot of trees, but we're pretty close to the city and you do, I do get a sense for whenever I get up to Maine or we go for a walk or we go into a park, you know, there is that sort of relaxation, or you kind of feel that release in many ways that the nature that nature can provide. But I do think there is a real theme where people are looking for solace, and I think it's also sort of tree, it goes across different industries. So they with, um, you know, work with, and I'm friends with so many interior designers, and they're really seeing, you know, people want like really beautiful calming spaces, either their bedroom or their living room, or there is a real desire for that sort of connection to something that will lower your stress level, you know, in a world that's going to become very stressful. Talk to me about colors, because I know that have a huge impact on our emotions. And you've been talking about kind of calming things and, uh, soft things. Uh, do you think that people will get to a place where they want brighter things and cheerful things, um, as we start to come out of this more? Well, it's funny because as I'm looking in my own living room, um, I have some really bright artwork. It's like true Paul Pop's true pop art in some ways. Um, and one artist, Beatrice mill Hayes, um, is a fabulous artist who works in a lot of collage and in, you know, primary colors and it's oranges and reds and bright bolts. Um, and another artist I have is, um, his name's Jeffrey Gibson and he's a wonderful, um, both he does sort of monumental works as well as works on paper and paintings. And he, his, his practices fabulous. Um, and his works are also these like really bright, cheery pieces that, um, that are different than I think what a lot of people can live with. But I think it's someone one because I've loved both artists practices for so long, that it's exciting to me. Um, so I, you know, I think it's a case by case, you know, people are gravitate toward different colors in, in so many different ways. It kind of is hard to describe, you know, will people move into another, another color palette, but many people already are, you know, just because it's what they they're interested in. Do you see, this happens over the course of someone's life? I mean, when you were younger, do you remember liking a certain set of colors and then as you've gotten older, that's changed. I think people not necessarily color, but I think, um, engagement in the arts changes and what you like changes. And I think it's really good to like be open and okay with that and like anything humans evolve. And I think about who I am now versus who I was 10 years ago is drastically different. And so every stage of life, I think the artwork you relate to in different ways and should change with that stage of life. Um, you know, 10 years ago, I would never have cared about maternal images. Now. I just love looking at a beautiful Merica sat or a beautiful Monet of a mother and child, because that's sort of what I'm in right now. And that's the phase of life I'm in. Um, and so with clients, you know, clients will either change artwork out as their intellectual interests or personal life changes. And so you'll hear about this in like the large art world, art market people, you know, moving out of old masters into contemporary because they're now sort of into a whole new space. And I wouldn't say my clients are doing that extreme of a change, but I think the more you look at art, the more, maybe challenging art you can sort of handle because you've sort of built up this Rolodex of images or ideas or concepts, and you start comparing different artists practices against the other one. Um, so I think it's really reasonable for people to feel like they outgrow art over time. Um, when I'm working with clients, I do always try to say, you know, if it's too easy right now, you're going to outgrow it really quickly. So let's not, let's find something that may be a little more rigorous so that you don't immediately feel like it's, it's too easy. Um, but I also share with clients like, let's, re-install your house. So if you are, you get too used to seeing the same thing for the, for five years, let's move it into a new space or give it to a child or donate it to an organization, you know, something like that. So that, you know, changes the, is the essence of life. And so it's really, I think, important to kind of be open to the fact that, um, the artwork you have today may not be the artwork you want to look at in 10 years. And I also on that same note, feel really comfortable with people making mistakes. Um, the first piece of some of the first pieces that I bought in my early twenties, I'm like, it's just not the thing that I want to look at now. And that's okay. And you kind of get that out of the way so that you can make those mistakes and then kind of learn from it and move on. Yeah. So as you're talking, I'm thinking about the poster that I had in college that I think was like, uh, I don't know if it was van Gogh's starry night or something like that, but something, you know, you buy at the college bookstore and, um, which I love, and it's not that I, I mean, I, if I had the original starry night, I'd probably put it on my wall, but since that's not likely to happen, you know, you're right. You have to kind of keep moving forward. Um, what would you say to people who have, or at the beginning of their art career, their art, um, buying or acquisition career? Because I think that people get, um, maybe a little intimidated if they don't have an art history background sometimes. And if you're a young professional, you're just starting out, you've got kids, you've got plenty of things to spend your money on, but maybe you want that one special piece you want, maybe it's a smaller piece. Maybe you just want something that's kind of aspirational for you. How would you direct them in that situation? I would, again, start by just, let's looking and look at lots and lots of things so that when you do make the decision on something, you feel really confident about it and you feel like, okay, I've reviewed everything. And in this either in the Boston market or based on a certain subject or a certain style, um, and so feeling confident about the decision I think is really, really important and excited. You know, this in the same breath, I love doing studio visits with artists when I can, because the connecting a client or a collector to an artist, then they have this like huge experience where they met someone and were in their studio and saw the whole practice and saw what they're working on or saw what they, what didn't work, what was an unsuccessful painting, which is really important as important to see as a really successful painting. Um, so I think that's also, especially sort of, my generation is really looking for those experiences and they want to sort of have an emotional connection in many ways to the artist and so that when someone comes into their home and asks them about the painting that's in the living room, they can say a few about it as well as, and I got to meet the artist and it was really special. And the same goes to the gas, going to the gallery, um, taking artists, taking clients to, you know, see an exhibition and see, you know, 20 works by an artist is really informative to sort of how the overall practice of the artist. And then also, um, selecting what they think is probably the best work from that group, which I think is always really interesting. So always start by looking, looking, looking, um, you know, educating yourself. What I love about Instagram is that clients will just like send me things all the time, or, you know, I'll post something and a client will respond to it. And so that's, what's also really nice is that even though we're not looking in person as much right now, we still have these digital avenues to spend, to spend time looking. The other thing that people don't really know about is that you can sometimes then maybe Portland art gallery won't like this, but you can ask for a payment plan and sometimes galleries or artists will be really open to that. And sometimes they're not, but it's not a proble